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Empire: Total War - Campaign & General Discussion
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Empire: Total War Heaven » Forums » Empire: Total War - Campaign & General Discussion » Ottoman first turn maximization
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Topic Subject:Ottoman first turn maximization
Grognir
Mariner
posted 05-05-13 12:21 PM EDT (US)         
Starting a H/H world domination game as the Ottomans. This is what I did on the first turn. Some of these are tips from elsewhere. Not sure if it's possible to do better.

1) re-arrange your ministers as outlined in the oft-googled strategy guide. It's actually fairly obvious what you need to do.

2) exempt all provinces from taxation.

3) w/Venice, trade Bosnia for Morea.

4) w/Austria, get trade agreement + $8k for Serbia

5) w/Crimea, give Moldavia for $7k. Army in Moldavia sent to help defend Crimea. I plan to pick up the general though via boat and send him to Rumelia to help defend against the inevitable Austrian attack.

6) w/Persia, get trade agreement + military alliance + $7k for Armenia.

7) w/Morocco, sell Bulgaria for $7k

8) w/France, offer your techs (grenades + canister) for trade agreement and physiocracy. They will counter for techs only and will pay you $990.

9) w/Mughals, offer your (now) 3 techs for $3k, they will counter for canister and physiocracy for $1200.

10) w/Great Britain, get trade agreement for physiocracy.

11) w/Prussia, offer trade agreement for physiocracy, they will counter for physiocracy + grenades.

12) Offer Savoy $1k for trade agreement.

13) Offer Denmark grenades + canister for trade agreement.

14) Get trade agreement w/Lousiana, no need to offer anything.

15) Get trade agreement w/New Spain, no need to offer anything.

16) Get trade agreement w/Thirteen Colonies, no need to offer anything.

17) Sell physiocracy to Denmark for $500.

I offered Prussia up to $2500 and canister for plug bayonets, but they don't seem to want to do that. I offered France $2k for a trade agreement and they came back w/$36k. As if.

So I begin the first turn w/ 14 trading partners and 38,190 gold, w/projected income of $5634 without any taxation. And physiocracy to enable expansion of cotton plantations. This is before building anything though I did disband the Bashi-Bazouks except for the one unit going to help defend Crimea. My plan is to hold onto Morea, Greece and Rumelia in Europe. I will cancel alliance w/Barbary states once Morocco attacks them and since their 100% muslim may build a force in Egypt to try to take some of their lands. Otherwise just build up my economy for a while. Hopefully Austria will be at war soon and I can take back the Balkans.

Once Russia & Sweden are at war I'll try to get an alliance w/Sweden for my techs.
AuthorReplies:
webstral
Mariner
posted 05-08-13 01:13 AM EDT (US)     1 / 7       
That is absolutely fascinating. Brilliant! I have tried the Ottomans a couple of times. Each time I have thought like a traditional national/imperial leader: hold onto as much territory as possible. Next time I try the Ottoman Empire, I may just start this way.

The musket is for fixing and softening the enemy. The bayonet is for destroying him.
Grognir
Mariner
posted 05-31-13 12:42 PM EDT (US)     2 / 7       
I've found a couple problems: in some new games the French won't trade Physiocracy for Canister & Grenades, also selling Moldavia to Crimean Khanate means early war with Austria who it seems invade Moldavia pretty early. An alternative is selling it to Georgia. Seems the Austrians won't invade in that case (although CK may not last as long).
Ecthelion
Mariner
(id: p90pro)
posted 07-06-13 07:44 PM EDT (US)     3 / 7       
Interesting.

I did trade Bosnia for Morea. It makes sense to shut off what would have been another point of attack in an inevitable war.

The majority of the other decisions are common sense.

The only ways we differ are tax exemption at the outset, keeping your allies (I drop both of them and make peace with Russia) and trading off more territories than you should.

The one thing the Ottomans need at the beginning, more than anything, is peace. Use that time to build an infrastructure and a military. Those territories you give away in the Balkans are your main buffer zone between you and the rest of Europe.

Sir, I have not yet begun to defile myself.
Swallow my pride? No thank you, Im too full of myself.
I bring you nothing but love and a shopping bag full of sexual depravity.
I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me.
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Grognir
Mariner
posted 09-19-13 04:44 PM EDT (US)     4 / 7       
Interesting, Ecthelion. Indeed, in my current H/H World Domination game, I couldn't find a buyer for Bulgaria and ended up giving it away to Russia for a peace treaty, which turned out great as it limited Austria's and Venice's advances towards Greece. So I'm amending my Ottoman first turn maximization to do this instead of selling it.

Edited to add: Well, I 'finished' my game, as it kept CTD'ing on Maratha's 1794 Winter turn. I had 40 of 45 provinces, just edged out Maratha for Prestige, and had all techs. Indeed, I tried several things, including DOW'ing Maratha even tho we were long-term allies and trade partners. Still, could not avoid CTD during Maratha's turn. So frustrating when that happens. I'm calling it a win, so there. I suppose I could go back to an earlier save, but nah.

I was fortunate in that I came to dominate *all* trade nodes. At the end there I had 14 trading ships on each of the 20 nodes. Most were dhows but stacks of traders and galleons as well.

Once established, alliance w/ France and Spain lasted throughout game. In late game going for 45 I took 4 pirate provinces and had force to conquer the Inuits. Took Iceland as well. Otherwise my power was in the Med, from Lombardy thru Baghdad, in Africa from Morocco and westward till Persia. Maratha had taken most of Russia except Kiev and Moscow, and I was kinda hoping to continue past 1800 with an epic Muslim vs Hindu conflict.

I went for all the special units: Military base in Bosnia to get both skirmisher types (Bosnian Panduks and Haydut Irregulars) recruitable in the region, the Hayduts are available in military bases throughout the Balkans but only both are recruitable in Bosnia. Military base in Bulgaria for Wallachian Boyars. Palestinian auxillerys, the blunderbuss-armed Libyan Kuloglu and Cairo Janissaries in Egypt, the Circassian Cavalry in Anatolia, Tartars in Crimea.

I did try for a Republican revolution, as I could find little on what happens w/Ottoman armies if you get that. In short: no new units (was hoping for some type of Republican Guard so that I could have at least one platoon-firing unit) but the only effects on units was that I could no longer build Mamelukes or Tartars (I may have lost all existing Tartars as well).

While I had a few line infantry in all armies, the bulk were skirmishers and Musselims, along with plenty of artillery, often including 4-5 mortars once percussion shells became available.

Oh well.

[This message has been edited by Grognir (edited 09-21-2013 @ 09:37 PM).]

snapintoa
Mariner
posted 10-27-13 11:08 AM EDT (US)     5 / 7       
I like this plan. Some notes from my experience with it:

  • Persia won't give me more than 6k (1k less than listed)
  • Morroco will give me up 8k (1k more than listed)
  • France keeps offering different amounts, from 400-1000
  • The Mughals will offer 1200 for two techs but will agree to just Physiocracy. Giving them canisters helps with fighting the Maratha.
  • Savoy will enter a trade agreement for as little as 450
  • Lastly, you can get Plug Bayonets from the Prussians but only if you deal with them first. They aren't interested in giving it to you if you have Physiocracy, and likewise the French won't trade techs if you already have Bayonets. At least as far as I can tell, I tried a lot of combinations to get both and none worked.
    With the strong trade reliance of this start, Physiocracy is definitely the more profitable of the two to take, but Bayonets can help with a more aggressive plan.

    [This message has been edited by snapintoa (edited 11-12-2013 @ 03:52 PM).]

  • snapintoa
    Mariner
    posted 11-12-13 04:33 PM EDT (US)     6 / 7       
    I made one big modification to this start to support my protectorates. Selling Moldavia to the Khanate weakens them and seems to guarantee an attack on them from Poland. Keeping strong protectorates on your borders is a fun challenge and also seems to be a very powerful strategy so far.

    Instead I sell Moldavia to Poland for 6k and a trade agreement. Make sure to move the Moldavian army into Crimea before selling.

    With some small support from Istanbul over the next turns this army can repel the Russian attack and then take Kiev. I gift Kiev to Crimea which immediately calms the population.

    Poland may attack Crimea at this point, but sometimes they are too busy with Prussia and Austria. Keep some troops around to discourage it, and to protect against Russian counter-attack. If you can help them hold Kiev while they build, Crimea will soon be a strong threat to your northern enemies and will build a decent fleet to help defend the Black Sea and your home ports.

    If you can manage to keep Poland from attacking, the only other threat to Istanbul is from Austria who usually give up the trade agreement and attack pretty soon.

    They seem to commit quite a lot of troops to this, even when being attacked aggressively by Prussia and Poland in the north.

    With that in mind, I move as many troops as I can to attack Malta as soon as I can. They don't have a lot of defenders at the start and while their navy is dangerous it only takes one ship to blockade their port. If the blockade is your first act of war you can keep their ships from intercepting your troop ship. Have it ready drop your army and retreat on the same turn.

    Trading two light galleys to neutralize the Knight's fleet is worth it and I've managed to keep all my ships alive with careful maneuvering.

    The army in Malta is in good position help the Barbary against an attack from Morocco that usually comes pretty soon. I join my ally, as it gives me a chance to retake unprotected Bulgaria and move my troops against Tangier. If it doesn't come, I initiate it when my troops are ready.

    With Malta and Morocco neutralized the Barbary States are suddenly a lot more helpful with control of the Mediterranean through the early game. Malta can be sold profitably or held as a useful staging point. The Barbary can be made even more useful by gifting it to them.

    Later in the game, when I have a stronger foothold and political interest in Europe, I plan to replace the Barbary with the Mamelukes as my North African protectorate.
    ur face
    Mariner
    posted 11-21-13 08:34 AM EDT (US)     7 / 7       
    How about trading three western provinces for the 3 persian provinces and selling egypt and everything else west of rumelia?
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