We’re sorry but we are currently still working on support for IE6 because of its non-compliance with common web standards. In the meantime, please consider upgrading to Internet Explorer 7, FireFox, Apple Safari, or Google Chrome.

TWH »

Empire: Total War Heaven



You must be logged in to post messages.
Please login or register

Empire: Total War - Land Battle Discussion
Moderated by Pitt, Awesome Eagle

Hop to:    
Welcome! You are not logged in. Please Login or Register.18 replies
Empire: Total War Heaven » Forums » Empire: Total War - Land Battle Discussion » Prussian army
Bottom
Topic Subject:Prussian army
Stonewall86
Mariner
posted 02-15-10 04:55 PM EDT (US)         
Quick question, does Prussia have skirmish units?
AuthorReplies:
NinjXPk
Mariner
posted 02-15-10 05:38 PM EDT (US)     1 / 18       
Yes, the prussian jaegers (my spelling is off)

They wear big captain hats

All Empires Crumble; there are no exceptions

Rise -> Zenith -> War -> Chaos -> Nothing
Monarchy -> Republic -> Empire -> Downfall -> Enlightenment
Stonewall86
Mariner
posted 02-15-10 07:21 PM EDT (US)     2 / 18       
What do you have to build to recruit them?
NinjXPk
Mariner
posted 02-15-10 07:38 PM EDT (US)     3 / 18       
Its what you have to build and research.

Basically you have to research everything on the left side of the military branch besides all the cav techs

Just put your mouse over the techs and read what they do, find the one that says allows recruitment of jeagers

You have to build the brandenburg gate in your capital

This applies with all factions, elite skirms can only be built in your capital and only when you have the highest level military building

All Empires Crumble; there are no exceptions

Rise -> Zenith -> War -> Chaos -> Nothing
Monarchy -> Republic -> Empire -> Downfall -> Enlightenment
Stonewall86
Mariner
posted 02-15-10 10:08 PM EDT (US)     4 / 18       
Thanks for the info, all hells breakin loose in my campaign, surrounded by enemies everywhere... Skirmishers sure would help!
Hussarknight
Seraph Emeritus
posted 02-17-10 05:33 AM EDT (US)     5 / 18       
Quick tip: you can use the building browser (accessible via the button in the bottom-right of the screen) to view the different buildings and what you can recruit from them.

          Hussarknight
TKwarrior17
Mariner
posted 03-22-10 03:36 PM EDT (US)     6 / 18       
Just a little information you might want to know, however: in the original campaign and DMUC addon, Prussian Line Infantry have the highest overall stats of all "vanilla" Line Infantry. They are also the cheapest to train and maintain. Moreover, most Prussian generals will have the attributes "Prussian Junker" and/or "Drillmaster". Both of these give the commanding general two extra command stars when leading infantry units.

The bottom line is this: Line Infantry are Prussia's backbone, and regardless of how good any skirmishers or cavalry are, Line Infantry will always be the cream of a successful Prussian army. It's just the way the game is made. Austria has their swift Hussars, the Ottomans have their massive artillery, Russia has her vast numbers, and Britain has her indomitable fleet. At least that much is historically correct.

It doesn't make a lot of sense to be training troops that are equivalent to your rivals', when by training Line Infantry, you get superior soldiers to your rivals while paying less.
Dark as Silver
Mariner
posted 05-06-10 01:46 AM EDT (US)     7 / 18       
Prussian Line Infantry have the highest overall stats of all "vanilla" Line Infantry
Actually Britain has the highest stats for vanilla line, or you could argue Sikh musketeers because they are the most accurate line inf and have armour.
TKwarrior17
Mariner
posted 05-14-10 02:15 PM EDT (US)     8 / 18       
Really? I might just make a mod to fix that, because Prussian Line Infantry, up until about the end of the Napoleonic Age (ca. 1840), were the most elite regular soldiers of any European army. In fact, British and later American soldiers were trained by Prussian drill sergeants.
shubhankar
Mariner
posted 06-02-10 06:59 AM EDT (US)     9 / 18       
Prussia owns the best of armies.
Pitt
Commodore
posted 06-02-10 08:29 AM EDT (US)     10 / 18       
Prussian Line Infantry, up until about the end of the Napoleonic Age (ca. 1840), were the most elite regular soldiers of any European army. In fact, British and later American soldiers were trained by Prussian drill sergeants.
Not exactly. You're probably getting confused with the general admiration for Frederick the Great's military system in the mid-18th Century, where states adopted elements of Prussian drill.

Prussian troops were extremely well drilled. But they weren't fast and generally placed far too little emphasis on skirmishing and light infantry. Prussian discipline was fierce and, to exaggerate only slightly, designed to turn ordinary soldiers into unimaginative automatons.

The Prussians were whipped by the French at the twin battles of Jena and Auerstadt in 1806. Their subsequent military reforms were based on the French model, and they raised many Landwehr (essentially militia) units to fight Napoleon after the Russian invasion.

The mania for Prussian drill vanished fairly rapidly with Britain's experience of more flexible formations in America (though in peace it made a comeback, until the Duke of York's unfortunate campaign in Flanders).

Generally speaking, British troops were trained with an emphasis on firearms drill that many continental states lacked. The Brown Bess pattern musket used by the British army also had a heavier calibre than the common continental musket.

Prior to Frederick, Prussian troops had been well trained in firearms drill (it was the Duke of Anhalt-Dessau who first mass-equipped troops with iron ramrods), but heavy casualties meant a rapid decrease in quality which was never really made good. The army Frederick left behind him was not as good as the one he inherited.

"Into the face of the young man who sat on the terrace of the Hotel Magnifique at Cannes there had crept a look of furtive shame, the shifty, hangdog look which announces that an Englishman is about to talk French." - P.G. Wodehouse, The Luck of the Bodkins
Dark as Silver
Mariner
posted 06-03-10 03:38 AM EDT (US)     11 / 18       
because Prussian Line Infantry, up until about the end of the Napoleonic Age (ca. 1840), were the most elite regular soldiers of any European army
No, historically Britain had the best soldiers, Prussic discipline was extreme (troops had capital punishment for almost every crime.) however it was designed to prevent them from questioning order they did no train with live ammo, only the British could afford to do that.
Clausewitz
Mariner
posted 06-09-10 10:20 AM EDT (US)     12 / 18       
I would actually argue that historically the Prussian army only became the best in europe after the succession of wilhelm I in the 1850's and the appointment of Bismarck in 1862. Indeed Bismarck was only appointed because it was believed he could push through parliament the changes to the budget which would see a massive increase in military spending. At the same time the growth in Prussian industry and development of new technology's allowed the Prussian army to become the best equipped in the world, with the mausser 1871 rifle still being used in WW1. The final proof of Prussian military prowess during this period would come from the Austro-Prussian war of 1864 and the Franco-Prussian war of 1870 both of which were won quickly and easily by the new Prussian military machine. Prussian line infantry may not have been the best in the world but the Prussian army as a whole was certainly superior to anything else in europe and in fact the world at that time.

hi btw im new, though i've been reading this forum for quite a while and found it very useful
Dark as Silver
Mariner
posted 06-10-10 01:01 PM EDT (US)     13 / 18       
the Austro-Prussian war of 1864 and the Franco-Prussian war of 1870 both of which were won quickly and easily by the new Prussian military machine.
I would actually agrue that the prussians won those wars due to Helmuth the elder's deployment strategy. The Prussians had their army equipped, organised and attacking within a week while their opponents were still getting organised.
Med8r
Mariner
posted 06-10-10 02:24 PM EDT (US)     14 / 18       
In any case, Prussia has had a long history of being able to field some of the best troops in the world, if not the best (and when you're constantly at war with everyone around you, you really don't have a choice but to excel, or be wiped out). In my own experiences in Empire, I've found that they pose much more of a threat than anyone else on the field of battle, bar none (in Europe, anyway). They may not have been the biggest or the best, but they're surely not to be underestimated nonetheless, in Empire anyway.
Schwerpunkt
Rake
posted 08-10-10 10:36 AM EDT (US)     15 / 18       
One day a German, a Russian and an American General were observing a combined exercise of their airborne forces.

The Russian General looked upward at some of his soldiers and commented: "Ahh Russians, we have the best soldiers in the world."

The German and American generals politely looked aside and discretely coughed. The Russian general looked at their disbelief and then flatly stated; “You do not believe… I will prove this.”

Looking up at the tower platform where his men were waiting their turn to parachute he shouted: “Yuri, leap from tower now, do not wait parachute!”

Yuri immediately stepped to the edge of the platform and shouted “For Mother Russia!” and plunged over the side. As the unfortunate trooper’s body slammed into the earth the Russian General commented: “You see, the best in the world.”

The German General did not reply. Instead he lifted his gaze to the tower where his men were awaiting and yelled: “Albrecht, for the Fatherland!”

The German paratrooper snapped rigidly to attention, saluted and replied: “Jawoll, für das Vaterland.” (yes, for the Fatherland) took a few steps back and ran off the platform , plummeting to his death in a perfect swan-dive. The German General looked at the Russian and said, “German soldiers, the VERY best in the world.”

When the American General said nothing the other two generals starred at him for a long moment until at last the he sighed deeply and shrugged, saying; “Alright, alright, I get the hint.”

Looking up at his soldiers standing atop a tower he commanded: “Hey, Johnson, jump off the tower without a ‘chute.”

Johnson looked down and yelled back, “No F@#@ing way ...SIR!”

The American General looked at the other generals and asked; “Any questions?”
NinjXPk
Mariner
posted 08-11-10 10:02 AM EDT (US)     16 / 18       
lol

All Empires Crumble; there are no exceptions

Rise -> Zenith -> War -> Chaos -> Nothing
Monarchy -> Republic -> Empire -> Downfall -> Enlightenment
TKwarrior17
Mariner
posted 09-08-10 04:09 AM EDT (US)     17 / 18       
On Schwerpunkt's note, there is an interesting quote from a Prussian Drill Sergeant employed by George Washington to train his Continental Army to fight the British. He wrote in his journal: "In European armies, you tell a soldier to do something and he does it. With the Americans, you must tell a soldier why he should do something and he does it."

It plays into the idea that free-thinking soldiers are superior to drill-hardened soldiers without a free will. In my opinion, it depends on the situation whether I would like an army with the flexibility of free-thought as opposed to the firmness of discipline. I would think when defending it would be best to have more disciplined troops that will hold their ground, whereas it would be best to employ with skirmish-style soldiers when on the offensive.

And while it may not be entirely true that Prussian line infantry are superior to British lines, the Prussians certainly have the cheapest available of all the factions.

As for the comment earlier, it is also true that von Moltke the elder's technological improvements and deployment reforms in the 1860s paved the way for modern warfare. The battlefield of the Austro-Prussian and Franco-Prussian wars would have greatly resembled the First World War from the Prussian side. In the Austro-Prussian war the Austrians saw the first rapid deployment by use of railways and the first use of breech-loading firearms en masse. One Prussian soldier could fire six rounds in the same time it took an Austrian to fire one. That's a hefty advantage when you're heavily outnumbered.

Un bon mot ne prouve rien. A witty saying proves nothing. - Voltaire
Dieu nous a donné le cadeau de vie; c'est jusqu'à nous de se donner le cadeau de vivre bien. God gave us the gift of life; it is up to us to give ourselves the gift of living well. - Voltaire

[This message has been edited by TKwarrior17 (edited 09-08-2010 @ 04:15 AM).]

Pitt
Commodore
posted 09-12-10 06:36 AM EDT (US)     18 / 18       
On Schwerpunkt's note, there is an interesting quote from a Prussian Drill Sergeant employed by George Washington to train his Continental Army to fight the British. He wrote in his journal: "In European armies, you tell a soldier to do something and he does it. With the Americans, you must tell a soldier why he should do something and he does it."
Monty said the same thing about British soldiers in the Second World War.

There's a difference though. Generally speaking, professional soldiers can be subjected to harder discipline and drill than militias composed of people whose stated ideal is freedom from oppression.
It plays into the idea that free-thinking soldiers are superior to drill-hardened soldiers without a free will. In my opinion, it depends on the situation whether I would like an army with the flexibility of free-thought as opposed to the firmness of discipline. I would think when defending it would be best to have more disciplined troops that will hold their ground, whereas it would be best to employ with skirmish-style soldiers when on the offensive.
As you intimated, it depends what you're asking them to do. If they're going to be standing in the main line of battle, you want them to do exactly as they're told, and have them drilled to such an extent that they can follow orders, stay in formation, and fire and reload without thinking.

Skirmishers have always been allowed more latitude of thought and initiative.

"Into the face of the young man who sat on the terrace of the Hotel Magnifique at Cannes there had crept a look of furtive shame, the shifty, hangdog look which announces that an Englishman is about to talk French." - P.G. Wodehouse, The Luck of the Bodkins
You must be logged in to post messages.
Please login or register

Hop to:    

Empire: Total War Heaven | HeavenGames